NORFOLK, Va. — President Joe Biden and former President Donald Trump have met for their first debate of the 2024 season, and there was no shortage of falsehoods. Among them was a claim where Trump referenced "the former governor of Virginia" and other Democrats supported killing babies after childbirth.
"The problem [Democrats] have is they're radical because they will take the life of a child in the eighth month, the ninth month, and even after birth, after birth," Trump said. "If you look at the former governor of Virginia, he was willing to do this. He said, 'We'll put the baby aside, and will determine what we do with the baby.' Meaning: We’ll kill the baby."
On a surface level, such a claim might seem ludicrous on its face. And it really is; Democrats have not said they support killing babies. Additionally, infanticide is criminalized in every state, and no state has passed a law that allows killing a baby during or immediately after birth.
So where did this lie come from, and how is a former Virginia governor involved?
Abortion rights advocates say terms like "after birth" and "late-term abortions" attempt to stigmatize abortions later in pregnancy. Abortions later in pregnancy are exceedingly rare. In 2021, less than 1% of abortions in the United States were performed at or after 21 weeks, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
Abortions later in pregnancy also are usually the result of serious complications, such as fetal anomalies, that put the life of the woman or fetus at risk, medical experts say. In most cases, these are also wanted pregnancies, experts say.
Going back to Trump's claim, the governor in question is Ralph Northam, a Democrat who served as Virginia's governor from 2018 to 2022. In addition to his foray into politics, Northam is a pediatric neurologist who currently practices at the Children's Hospital of The King's Daughters.
In 2019, Northam gave an interview to radio station WTOP, where he responded to a question about whether he supported state legislation that would have loosened restrictions on abortions later in pregnancy.
Many anti-abortion activists, including Trump, have highlighted this particular comment made in the interview:
"If a mother is in labor, I can tell you exactly what would happen," Northam said. "The infant would be delivered, the infant would be kept comfortable, the infant would be resuscitated if that’s what the mother and the family desired. And then a discussion would ensue between the physicians and the mother."
But Northam was only addressing what happens in cases where a baby is born with severe deformities and has a low chance of survival. What's often left out of the above quote is what he said immediately before it:
"When we talk about third-trimester abortions, these are done with the consent of, obviously, the consent of the mother, with the consent of the physicians -- more than one physician, by the way -- and it's done in cases where there may be severe deformities. There may be a fetus that's non-viable."
He then gives the hypothetical example about a mother in labor.
The governor's question and response can be seen in the video below, beginning at 38:46:
His comments were part of a response to a question about whether he supported a bill proposed in 2019 by Virginia House Del. Kathy Tran, which would have loosened the state’s restrictions on abortion later in pregnancy, including the third trimester.
Republican Del. Todd Gilbert had recently asked Tran, a Democrat, during a committee hearing whether her legislation would let a pregnant woman who is dilating request an abortion if a doctor certified that the woman’s mental health was impaired.
"My bill would allow that, yes," Tran said in response. She later told The Washington Post that she "misspoke" and that she should have said, "Clearly, no, because infanticide is not allowed in Virginia, and what would have happened in that moment would be a live birth."
Ofirah Yheskel, a then-spokesperson for Northam, said at the time that he was only trying to describe the “tragic or difficult circumstances” often involved in late-term abortion.
“Attempts to extrapolate these comments otherwise is in bad faith and underscores exactly why the governor believes physicians and women, not legislators, should make these difficult and deeply personal medical decisions,” she said.
Experts told the Associated Press that it is not physically possible to perform an abortion later in pregnancy if a woman has already gone into labor naturally.
“Patients who are laboring at term are never having an abortion,” said Sarah Prager, a professor of obstetrics and gynecology at the University of Washington. “They are having a delivery.”
Parents whose babies are born with a low probability of survival then make decisions about whether to provide palliative care or to take extraordinary measures to save them.
There are many reasons patients might seek an abortion later in pregnancy, including a catastrophic fetal diagnosis and risks to their own health.
Amy Nelson, an OB-GYN in Virginia, said that it is unlikely any ethical doctor would agree to perform an abortion simply because a woman changed her mind about an entirely healthy pregnancy late in the game, even if it is legally permissible.
“Ethics would get involved more than anything else,” she explained.
Even in states with few to no restrictions on abortions, there are other mechanisms to ensure appropriate decisions are made.
“The truth is that all physicians in the United States are bound by medical ethics and standards, state law, federal law, and the bylaws of their professional medical associations,” said Jamila Perritt, an OB-GYN in Washington, D.C. and the president and CEO of the advocacy organization Physicians for Reproductive Health.
Kristyn Brandi, an OB-GYN in New Jersey who provides abortions later in pregnancy, said that she is “not worried about not having a limit because I know that I trust my patients to make decisions that are best for them.”
She added that she has never met anyone “who just kind of woke up one day and decided that they didn’t want to be pregnant.”